On this podcast, if you’ve listened any length of time, you’ve probably heard us talk about schooling or education. We’ve interviewed teachers, parents—about various types of schools and school programs. Renee & I chose different routes of education for our children: she chiefly homeschooled while my children were in local public magnet schools K-12.
We live in middle Tennessee—about 30 miles southeast of downtown Nashville, in what’s considered a suburb of Nashville. It’s “urban” but we are surrounded by rural counties. Our city proper has a population of about 350,000—and we’re growing.
All that’s relevant because today we’re talking about safety in schools, and if you assume we’re from the rural South where everyone says “yes, ma’am and yes, sir” and manners matter—well, that’s maybe partially true. You might assume we’re not having to tackle the stereotypically “inner city” issues of school violence found in larger, more urban cities.
**We are NOT talking about the heartbreaking and unfathomable school shootings that seem to be on the news on a regular basis. Here, close to our county, students and families are still reeling from the trauma of Nashville’s Covenant School incident in March of 2023. Events like that get covered and analyzed widely.
Today we want to open a discussion about safety in general. What might students and teachers expect on an average Tuesday on a high school or elementary school campus?
Recently we’ve been hearing from teachers in our school systems who’ve had some growing concerns about the state of things there. And if you’re like us, this may be surprising. Our kids don’t always tell us all the details of their days or let us in on the drama, bullying, or situations they might witness.
Maybe they don’t want us to worry or intervene. They imagine it may go away or they should be able to handle it on their own.
What about teachers? They’re regular people who go to work every day. You’d imagine THEY come home and talk about the things they experience on a daily basis. You’d expect their spouses, friends, and family members are aware of what they may be carrying.
In the fall of 2019, 53.9 million US children were enrolled in schools across our country. 9% of those were in private schools.
(Private school—just for sake of definition—is a school that doesn’t depend on local or nat’l government for funding. It could be religious-based or founded by other organizations that rely on their own fundraising. Typically, private schools require tuition from students, while K-12 public schools in the US are paid for by tax dollars.)
Public and private schools are often pitted against each other, not only in terms of quality of education but also concerning school safety. While violence can occur at any type of school, school safety statistics show that private schools often offer more safety to students.
- During the 2017–2018 school year, US public schools experienced an estimated 962,300 violent incidents and 476,100 non-violent incidents. (National Center of Education Statistics, 2019)
- Around 71% of public schools experienced at least one violent incident, while 65% of these schools reported at least one non-violent incident. (National Center of Education Statistics, 2019)
- Nearly half of public school students report gang activity at their school, while only 2% of private school students do. (Seattle PI , n.d.). SOURCE
In the US, about HALF of students aged 13-15 have said they experience violence, such as physical fights or forms of bullying, from their peers in and around school. This same statistic holds true worldwide, also.
In school year 2021–22, there were 3.2 million full-time equivalent (FTE) teachers in public schools. In 2019–20, there were 0.5 million FTE teachers in private schools.
SOMEONE—the teachers we expect to care for and steward our children for 7-8 hours a day—is dealing with the incidents in the classrooms, hallways, and locker rooms.
We spoke at length with one of those teachers, who declined to share her name for the sake of her job.
How many years have you been a teacher? Always in public schools?
13 yrs in the public school system, 1 yr in private school. Chiefly high school level.
What sort of incidents or events do you personally experience on a regular basis?
In addition to outright fights, she’s had many “disruptive” students in class. Disruption goes beyond the “talking to your neighbor” or flying paper airplanes/spitballs… It’s outright yelling and cursing. On one occasion having a desk thrown. Multiple accounts of a student (having been called out for being late or asked to do work) going into a tirade outside the classroom, pounding on the classroom door screaming obscenities at her. Having a student in class with an ankle monitor on (with no idea why).
Have you seen changes over your time in the school system? How & why do you think things have changed?
In 1975, the IDEA law was passed under Gerald Ford (Individuals with Disabilities Education Act). The thinking was to meet the needs of and improve results for infants, toddlers, children, and youth with disabilities and their families. Initially, the impetus was for inclusion of Downs Syndrome children. In 1990, the law changed to include TBI (traumatic brain injury) and autism spectrum. Since then, it’s expanded even further to include students with behavioral issues (e.g., Turrett’s, impulse control, etc….).
The fundamental idea, which I think most parents are on board with, is that everyone has a right to education. Instead of separating students with special needs, there IS good that comes from inclusion in a mainstream classroom. Special needs students learn social skills from peers and mainstream students learn empathy, understanding, and tolerance. That’s the way it’s meant to work. If your healthy, achieving child never encounters anyone in a wheelchair or with speech or differences in abilities, they’re much less likely to know how to treat someone when they DO encounter them.
From the perspective of the parents of special needs children: they have to fight for their kids in ways mainstream parents can’t conceive of. Every step of the way, if they’re in the education system, they’re having to bang their drum, meet with administration & teachers, push for certain types of accommodations or different sorts of challenges… It’s a TOUGH road and a win for them & their kids to have classroom inclusion (in part or all of the school day).
That requires funding, skilled teachers and assistants, counselors, and an admin that’s on board. (when they’re already buried in paperwork, testing, parent-teacher clashes, and their actual JOB of teaching math or reading or science to 20+ kids).
The 1997 amendments to the IDEA included allowances for disciplinary actions schools can take with students with disabilities. Among the provisions was the right for a school to remove a student from the school for up to 45 days if they’re involved with drugs or weapons.
When WE were in school, back in the 70’s-80’s, students could actually be permanently expelled. I witnessed ONE problem student in the mid 70’s and the things our teacher had to do to get that child under control in the classroom would NOT fly in today’s classrooms.
Now there’s no more kicking anyone out. If there’s a discipline issue, a student can go to an “alternative school” if one is available, but if those are full (and most are), after 10 days or so, (not the 45 or full semester allowed) they are allowed to go back to their regular school setting. There’s no teeth to the consequences.
Now we’re dealing with students with “Oppositional Defiant Disorder”, where kids are angry, refuse to follow instructions, seek revenge, deliberately bother others. Or perhaps their IEP states they “can’t tell the difference between right or wrong,” so they can’t be punished if they attack another student. If a student with one or more disorders has a meltdown, teachers may have to evacuate the classroom while that student rages out of control.
If a student has an IEP (individual educational plan), it’s even harder to get them removed from a classroom because their “behavior” may be specified (and therefore allowable) on their record. Meaning teachers will have to put up with and try to accommodate severe behavior issues in a classroom WHILE ALSO trying to TEACH a subject.
Have these escalated since 2020/21 (pandemic issues)?
Some, in that there’s plenty of mental health issues to go around…everyone is more anxious, less engaged, carrying depression or the fallout of an entire school year essentially “lost” –academically and socially– to the pandemic.
Phones are always always always an issue. The more addicted the kids are, the less you can teach and the more bullying & escalation of social issues you have in a given school day. Some students literally cannot physically handle being away from their devices (putting it in a case during class or having it confiscated). If you require no phones, you also have to require no smart watches, ipads, laptops and the rest. It’s a constant swim upstream and an added battle that wears teachers down.
The presence of phones also means that everything –every conversation or disciplinary action or issue– is probably being recorded. (which can be taken out of context or edited easily)
We hear a lot about teacher retention (esp since the disastrous school situation during 2020). SO many seasoned teachers are leaving the profession. I know many eager, new teachers who barely last their first year before jumping ship. Would you say school safety is a contributing factor to this?
Yes. New teachers aren’t prepared for the low expectation of safety. College majors in education are plummeting. We couldn’t find a HS senior last year to give away a teacher scholarship to, with a graduating class of around 500.
***EXPECTATION OF SAFETY: Interesting phrase. You mentioned a particular court case related to that. Last Jan, Abby Zwerner, a first grade teacher in Virginia, was shot by one of her students. This is a 6 yr old. What we know now is that that child was known to be violent and was required to be in class with a parent (which they declined). The teacher tried to sue the county school system and was told she could possibly claim worker’s comp, that she should have had no reasonable expectation of safety. Look at how bad the schools are…you should’ve known it was safe, even at the elementary school level.
https://projects.sun-sentinel.com/teenage-time-bombs/how-schools-manage-violent-kids/
(I believe now, almost a yr later, a judge has ruled she CAN proceed with a lawsuit.)
***BUT THIS BEGS THE QUESTION: If school boards are saying that teachers HAVE NO REASONABLE EXPECTATION OF SAFETY, then what does that say about the STUDENTS IN THEIR CARE????
What other profession does our society say that of??? Prison guards? Possibly ER staff? The police force??
The frequency of school shootings I believe has to be tied to this whole issue. We rightfully go nuts about that and at the same time, most parents of students in the General Population are unaware of the disruptions and violence that goes on on a daily basis.
Unless…they’ve been caught up in it. There are multiple cases of assault and bullying in a school setting where parents of the victim have appealed to the administration for help. The solution, more often than not, is for the victim–not the offender(s)!!–to transfer to a different school system. (Admin & school boards, always concerned about funding, are wary of the lawsuits that likely await them if they press the issue with parents of the offenders.)
Is there any sort of training for this? Teachers graduate with an elementary or secondary education degree, and maybe there are courses now or student teaching that includes special education inclusion or classroom management. Is this effective? Would this prepare a 24 yr old young woman for an encounter with a HS male?
There aren’t enough special ed teachers or school counselors to do the 1:1 needed with these types of students, who are in schools in increasing numbers. There is some mention of these things when you get your education degree, but even with student teaching, there’s not experience/exposure that would prepare a new teacher for some of the things I’ve encountered.
Add to that: more often than not, the attitude of parents to educators is to villify teachers, undermine their authority, and engender disrespect. If students are hearing this sort of thing at home, what are the odds they’ll listen when a teacher asks them to do their math? If they think it’s acceptable to throw a desk or pound on a door and scream obscenities, (which you can only imagine they’re doing regularly at home as well), how likely is it that they’ll show up on time, participate in learning and have decorum in class?
Renee: I get that to some degree… SOME teachers ARE bad. SOME add their personal agendas to the curriculum, and parents want to be able to counteract that. There’s a crisis of trust in ALL sorts of authority. The news reports teachers having inappropriate contact/relationships with students. What’s the balance?
Sadly, bad teachers exist. Bad things happen like in all fields. Most good teachers want all that garbage out, too. Most good teachers are just as appalled—and have their OWN KIDS in schools. We don’t want our OWN kids subjected to all that either. MOST teachers just want to teach our subjects, we want kids to turn their stuff in and be kind to each other. For some of that stuff–the reports of what’s being taught or forced into curriculum…check your sources. The reality is that there’s not even time for me to go to the restroom during a school day, let alone indoctrinate your child with add’l material while I’m handling class disruptions. That’s not how it actually works.
Expectation of intervention? Role of SRO?
Teachers are not allowed to TOUCH students for any reason. There are so many litigious parents now–and the parents of the sort of violent/aggressive students I’m talking about tend to be moreso. If a teacher tries to break up a fight in the hallway–even to ensure the safety of other children who are being attacked—they do so knowing there’s a chance for a lawsuit. Only SROs (school resource officer) can do that. You hope they’re on campus and available when you need them.
If administration intervenes and meets with the parent(s) to recommend intervention or maybe that the parent attend class with the student as a stop-gap measure, the parent(s) may always decline these recommendations/suggestions. Think about it: they have to work; also, school provides them a 7 hr break from THEM having to deal with these same issues at home. I imagine it would be more than overwhelming & exhausting.
PREVENTIVE MEASURES (how effective are they?)
Due to the high incidence of crime and violence in schools in the US, various organizations have committed to help schools and school systems improve preparedness and overall safety. To achieve these goals, many schools have implemented strategies such as improved student supervision and school hardening, which involves purchasing advanced surveillance equipment and bullet-proofing technologies.
- Some schools (35%) used an out-of-school suspension of at least five days to discipline students found in possession of weapons other than firearms or explosive devices. (NCES, 2019)
- More schools located in cities (50%) and suburbs (49%) reported having a threat assessment team for the 2017 to 2018 school year, compared to schools in towns (38%) and rural areas (34%). (NCES, 2019)
- 35% of charter schools had security personnel present at least once a week, compared to 21% of traditional public schools. (NCES, 2019)
- Meanwhile, 63% of teachers strongly oppose receiving special training to carry guns in school. (Gallup, 2018)
- 27% of registered voters in the US strongly support the notion of teachers being equipped with concealed firearms to respond in the event of a school shooting. (Morning Consult, 2019)
- The three factors that schools report to have the biggest impact on crime prevention measures were: inadequate funds (36%), lack of alternative placements or programs for disruptive students (34%), and district policies on disciplining special education (19%). (NCES, 2019)
Just this past year, our city schools introduced trained “calm coaches”. Their goal is to help students process their emotions so they can stay learning in the classroom. That’s one small step.
What do you think it might take to improve the situation?
First, being aware that this is the school environment that’s out there. Classrooms today are likely not what parents themselves experienced even 10-15 years ago.
Then it will take parents of the general population to say something to your school administrations and your school boards. Be as squeaky a wheel as the parents advocating for inclusion. Are we sacrificing the many for the few? What’s our expectation of safety?
Know about your school system: how many of your schools are fully staffed? How many SROs and school counselors are on site each day?
Not all teachers are privy to all student records at a school. Maybe your child isn’t in a classroom with a bad actor, but they’re in the lunchroom, playground, or gym together. Is that ok with you?