With Author Doug Smith
Today is part 2 of our topic Should My Kid Watch That? As suggested by a listener. In our first episode we heard from you, our listeners, about what watching screens did to your kids. We recommended an Instagram account @JerricaSannes (raisewildflowers.com) for more in-depth information on what kids shows are designed to do to your child’s brain. Yikes!
One of our listers, Mariah Wilson, recommended a book that her dad, Doug Smith wrote. It’s called Unintentional: How Screens Secretly Shape Your Desires and How You Can Break Free. So, she helped us get in contact with him, and I got his book on Audible and started listening on my way to a conference last week. I’m also happy to say Bonnie and I both now have the paperback books for ourselves and this will guide our interview today.
Hey, Doug! Thanks for being here!
Can you tell our listeners a little bit about yourself?
–are you a Luddite? Are you just anti-tech? Doug is actually a software developer, a self-described tech nerd.
One of the most surprising and concerning concepts in your book is the idea of free will and screens (chapter 2, UnPrepared) You introduce the reader to “several powerful, weaponized desire-forming methods aimed at each of us.” Can you walk us through those?
— isn’t technology morally neutral? Isn’t it what we DO with it that determines its effects?
The Social Dilemma came out on Netflix in 2020 and pulled back the curtain on some of what’s actually going on behind the screen with most platforms. Although startling, I’m not sure knowing the truth of the matter had any real effect on screen usage. That’s how strong the addiction is.
In chapter 3, UnPrincipled, you describe how companies use propaganda to influence our screen usage. Can you tell our listeners what they’re doing?
You and I were talking via email about the observation I had and you had definitely already fleshed out that there are lots of correlations between Big Tobacco and Big Tech. Can you run through that comparison for us?
In chapter 4, UnBelievable, you talk about the unseen forces behind this marketing, propaganda etc for screens. (See pages 56-57 for list). What would you want parents to realize about what is going on in the unseen realm that may be a factor in the tidal wave of screen usage around the world?
In chapter 5, UnEvaluated, you invite your reader to take an assessment of where they are and where their kids are. One of my favorite lines is this: “Much of our identity –who we really are–is revealed by how we spend our time.” (p72) Shew! Yes! David and I learned this principle early on in our marriage concerning money: If you have not been faithful in the use of worldly wealth, who will entrust the true riches to you? I used to have that verse taped to the top of my checkbook. 🙂 I probably need to write it in Sharpie on my debit card! How can we get a true and honest picture of how we are spending our time?
Another great point from that chapter is “direction, not intention, determines your destination.” We talk A LOT about being intentional on this podcast. You’ll never get where you want to go if you aren’t aiming. So what do you mean by this in terms of screens and addiction?
In chapter 6, UnAnticipated, you begin a transition from the bad news to the good news or becoming intentional. You talk about vision vs purpose. (see p 82) How will understanding those two principles help moms and dads who want better for themselves and their kids?
The second half of the book moves from the bad news to action. You talk about five practices that we can begin to do a hard reset on this screen-addicted life many of us are living.
Five Practices
- Surrender to Christ, the anchor of your intentional life
- Find and Remove What Entangles You
- Renew Your Mind with What’s Real and True
- Replace Harmful Habits with Helpful Ones
- Use Your Freedom to Pursue Your Calling
You suggest the above five practices in chapters 7-11. Can you explain a bit about each of them?
—not just saying no, no, no…what are we about? What bigger thing are we saying yes to? Phil 4:8 (whatever is true, honest, just, pure, lovely, of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.) Maybe it DOES give connection, but it’s a poor substitute for REAL connection & we are meant for MORE.
—families in solidarity, backing each other up
In chapter 12, UnIntentional, you tell this story about the Rechabites (who are they??) that is tucked away in Jeremiah 35. (p 166-169) It stuck with me. I think it’s a fabulous story to revisit in our culture today as we strive to be in the world but not OF the world. Can you tell that story?
We interviewed Jane Heather Clayton, mom of 7, on our prayer podcast (season 2 episode 22) from 11/29/21. She and her husband, Roger, have never had a television in their home and they delay smartphones for much longer than the average parent, so I asked for her input on this topic. This is what she sent me:
The Bible says to guard your heart above all else, for it is the wellspring of life. We need to take this verse very seriously as mothers. Our children are not wise enough to know how to guard their hearts, so that is the job entrusted to us as parents. So what we allow them to see, hear and read is very important because it affects what comes out of them as they grow older. Also, when you allow your children to be exposed to things that are not of God, the demonic world gets access to them. There are literally demons that attach themselves to our children through wrong entertainment, wrong video games, wrong music, and many things of the world.
I like the illustration of you having a beautiful pitcher of clear water, but then you pour just a quarter cup of mud into it and then what happens to the whole pitcher of water? So a little access to evil in your kids life can contaminate the whole thing. Satan is looking for some in road access. I really encourage mothers to cleanse their homes of anything of the world. I encourage them to get all worldly music books and movies and Screen access out of their home. Here’s another illustration. Suppose you wanted to have a really clean air home so you buy air purifiers and put them all around the house. But at the same time there are five men over in the corners of your houses smoking cigars. How far are you going to get in getting clean air in your home? Our homes are the same way we want really spiritual godly homes, but then we leave pockets of darkness in our home and are surprised when we don’t see holiness in our children.
Our family standards have been no TV for 26 years now and I have not regretted that once. We also don’t have screen time. We bought cell phones for our kids at the age around 17 and 18 and kept them accountable for what they were doing on them. We’ve never done video games and only play Christian music in our home. That may all sound radical but that’s great with me because I want to live radically for the Lord. The enemy is not messing around and nor can we.
I just want to reiterate that phones are not as necessary as our society wants us to think that they are. We as parents know that we grew up without phones and we survived perfectly fine, and so can our kids.
This reminds me of your story from the Brentwood Public Library (p 169) with the mom and son and a pencil and paper… Can you tell that story?
You have 4 grown daughters–which means you were parenting about the same time WE were. Your girls were tweens & teens around 2008 when the dam broke loose. We can woulda-coulda-shoulda all day long about choices we made before we knew what was happening. I know I made mistakes & would definitely have delayed screens/phones MUCH longer than we did, and we would’ve had to endure some major push-back from our kids had we done so.
We know from books like Stolen Focus and Glow Kids the neurological damage happening to very young kids exposed to screens. There’s a “Wait til 8” push right now that urges parents to wait until 8th grade, but that’s about 13 yrs old, just when all the insecurity & peer pressure is at its worst. IS there a “safer” age to allow phones/ipads/screens?
What would you say to parents today who were like us—the horse is already out of the barn and they’ve already given access? (We seem to be ok with old fashioned concepts like stranger-danger, but we think nothing of putting our kids in an online community of complete strangers whose JOB title is “influencer.”)
Do you have anything you’d like to say to our listeners before we close?
SCREENSTRONG.ORG is a great resource for families who see the effects or who have young children and want to get ahead of the tsunami!!
Last week, lawmakers introduced a bipartisan bill to create a minimum age for posting on social media. The “Protecting Kids on Social Media Act” would bar platforms like TikTok, Snap, and Instagram from letting kids younger than 13 create accounts & require parental consent to open accounts for users under 18. Age verification laws were passed in Arkansas and Utah recently. Utah added a 10:30 social curfew for kids. Dozens of US school districts have sued Tiktok, Meta, and YouTube, alleging they’re “knowingly creating an unprecedented mental health crisis.”
In his book, Counter Culture, David Platt writes “In a culture that places great emphasis on leisure, luxury, financial gain, self-improvement, and material possessions, it will be increasingly countercultural for Christians to work diligently, live simply, give sacrificially, help constructively, and invest eternally.” And I would add, it will be increasingly countercultural for us to treat screens as the addictive, dangerous tools they are.